The pretty, the nerdy and the ugly

[flexagon]

I'm definitely doing my best to weird people out today--this is a pretty casual office, and today I'm wearing a black tango dress with a ragged handkerchief edge that flutters all over the place, and heels, and yes, pearls. It's fun to see who asks me what's going on and who just gives me an odd look. What's up, of course, is that tonight is the last tango class and I thought it'd be fun to dress up for it.

Also good: Coraline is finally out in paperback as of today, and it's on its way to me. Here's hoping it arrives before I leave for NJ next Wednesday. I really wanted to buy The Phoenix Exultant for the trip since it would have been a long enough read for sure and I just read its prequel, but noooooooo, it's not coming out in paperback until September. *snivel* *life is no fair*

Work is still evil... here's hoping I can take this weekend off, or (since I'm supposed to be loading all our stuff onto a laptop) at the very least maybe I can work from home instead of schlepping my tired self in here.

Regarding a couple of days ago: what, no replies to my bachelor(/-ette) party rant? I definitely thought we had some pro-bachelor-party types online. I was curious what they would say as they sprang to the parties' defense.

Comments

Re: Oh, I'm jealous...

[flexagon]

Working naked? ooh... webcam! webcam! ;)

I don't really see him doing anything awful either--but I think it does make me nervous that the guys throwing it are single, and old friends of his, rather than the nice married ones from here that I know better. Hmmm. Well, at least they like me, so they won't be doing anything actively malicious. And the married friends will be invited. And the whole thing should keep HLM too busy to get all worried about the wedding.

I think I've been disturbed on some level ever since I read this. Every time I read it I more or less want to run screaming.

Hmm.

[bluechromis.livejournal.com]

That is a terrible story, and I doubt hiddenbear would make you feel better, since he's definitely a "toe-the-line bachelor parties are sacred" sort. Sort of makes me wonder if I'm being naive thinking that a guy I'd pick wouldn't do something like that. I still say I really can't see HLM doing that.

:-P

[hiddenbear.livejournal.com]

:-P
I've told you exactly what my bachelor party is going to be (assuming I ever get married) and you know it is the complete opposite to that.

Re: :-P

[bluechromis.livejournal.com]

The whole male-loyalty-secrecy thing is what I was talking about.

It's different...

[hiddenbear.livejournal.com]

talking about specifics. I wouldn't talk about any one bachelor party, but I have no problem talking about bachelor parties in general. And there my feelings are pretty well thought out, considering I've been to a fair number throughout the past eight years.
But my ':-P' was directed at your comment which seemed to imply that you had given up hope that there are men out there who aren't as vile and disrespectful as the one in the story ... or is just that you think those are the only ones you find?

Why the secrecy?

[bluechromis.livejournal.com]

If nothing bad is going on it seems like it should be like any other party where the details would naturally be shared.

It's not that I've given up hope. I was actually assuming that most don't do it...but then, in the midst of writing a reassuring note to soyfetus I stopped to think about it, and was like well, hiddenbear is vehemently against telling what is going on, so that's pretty strong evidence that there's something shady that goes on at them (since, as you say, you've been to a lot), and so I could very well be being very naive. However, still don't think HLM would be that sort. Just can't see it. Others? Can see it.

Re: Why the secrecy?

[flexagon]

Right on. Why the frickin' secrecy if things aren't happening that the bride wouldn't want to know about? I understand a guys' night out, but most of them are not cloaked in this kind of sneaky frat-boy vibe.

By the way, bc, I fully believe that each and every man on earth except possibly HLM and (most of) my friends' husbands is in fact a raging out-of-control cheater under the skin. Just can't summon up the faith to believe in them on more than a case-by-case basis. :b Even so, I think I can count about five good ones, so there's probably a sixth out there somewhere. And if I knew who he was, I'd give him your phone# in a heartbeat. {hug}

Re: Why the secrecy?

[hiddenbear.livejournal.com]

Let's take a hypothetical:
Joe goes to 10 bachelor parties. 9 are pretty tame, and 1 is crazy with strippers and prostitutes. After each of the 9, Joe chats about what happened (since nothing much did) with whomever. However, the last one Joe is tight lipped about, for obvious reasons. Anyone who had heard Joe talk about the other 9 would know something bad went on at the one.

So instead of running into that, I don't talk about any of them and then it is impossible to know which were bad and which were good.

Now, both my brothers have openly talked about their bachelor parties (which were both weekend retreats to a cabin in some small town where we drank, played cards, and hung out), so I feel free to talk about those. And a few other friends have had open bachelor parties (i.e. the bride and anyone else who cared could know exactly what happened). So those, I will sometimes talk about. But if there is any doubt, then it isn't my secret to share ... so I don't ... regardless of whether they were tame, had strippers, or whatever.

For the record:
I have been to awesome bachelor parties where there wasn't a single woman the entire time.
I have been to awesome bachelor parties at public events with thousands of people around.
I have been to awesome bachelor parties where we have gone to strip clubs. In all cases of these, the bride knew the guy was going to go to strip clubs.
I have never been to a bachelor party anything like the one described in that story, nor have I been to one where the bachelor did anything worse than look at strippers on a stage ... this is not to say that those don't occur, cause obviously they do. I'd hope that I would have the moral fortitude to remove myself from one of those, cause I don't agree with them at all ... but I am weak so I'm not sure I would.

Oh no, soyfetus...

[hiddenbear.livejournal.com]

I've never been to one like that ... I've heard of one and was revolted. That man had a confused view of the world, of his fiancee, and of marriage. HLM doesn't have those problems and you know it. You know you trust him ... but if you need to confront him beforehand about the real realities of bachelor parties, then don't hesitate.
old friends grow up. and if they haven't, HLM has.

Re: Oh no, soyfetus...

[flexagon]

So the ever-so-loyal-to-men hiddenbear doesn't have such scary things to say after all! {hug} I'm glad you haven't been to anything like that. It increases my belief/hope that it is not that common. Statistics... I want... statistics...

Anyway, yeah... I know HLM has grown up. Every time I bother to picture him in some actual place with his friends and an actual stripper or whatever, I see him being mostly his reserved and somewhat embarrassed self. And he knows I'm nervous, and he might ask for something totally innocent anyway. It's just scary, and it's taken me forever to get over a constant fear of being cheated on anyway, and this is sooooooo the stereotypical venue for this kind of thing to happen... you know? It all tempts me to revert to my old strategy of being as paranoid as possible so I can't be blindsided. :)

Probably this will follow the usual pattern of scary things being less scary when he is involved. Probably. I just, ick. I wish I were more sure of all this. I wish I trusted his friends more (as I might if I knew them better). I don't like the "final fling before being tied down" idea... that should be done before getting together with me. Otherwise, what's the point? Aren't people getting married because, you know, they want to be married? And I dunno what's with the idea of this being one's last chance to go out with friends of the same gender, or something, anyway. Ick ick ick. You are listening to one revolted soyfetus. :b

Hmm..

[hiddenbear.livejournal.com]

IMHO...
what's with the idea of this being one's last chance to go out with friends of the same gender
We all know it's not. We all know that marriage isn't the end of life ... that's all just guys talking for the sake of talking.

statistics
In our circles, I would say that crazy (where crazy is defined as anything more than watching strippers at a strip club) bachelor parties for people older than 23 are rare ... perhaps 1 in a 100.
Younger than 23, I won't guess at. And out of our circles, I have no idea. I'd define our circle as generally as well educated NorthEasterners, though that might be too wide.

Aren't people getting married because, you know, they want to be married?
I'd hope so ... but perhaps my marriage beliefs and ability to commit mean that I am not qualified to talk for those who want a crazy bachelor party.

Ick ick ick
HLM isn't icky, so I'm confident laying down money that his bachelor party won't be icky ... lay down guidelines for both your party and his, make sure to communicate them to the wedding party such that everyone knows these are the same rules for both sides and they will be abided by ... after that, you'll just have to trust HLM.